[BALUG-Talk] The Goodness of Carpool messages - was RE: Carpool from Berkeley...

[john_re]

Hi Andrew,
On Thu, 26 Jun 2008 11:22:10 -0700 (PDT), "Andrew Fife"  
<afife at untangle.com> said:
> Hi John:
> 
> While not totally off topic, your message about carpooling to PenLUG
> would
> be more appropriate for the PenLUG mailing list.  We don't want the BALUG
> list to devolve into a LUG carpool list.

The point is well taken about, to put it into the larger, & proper
context, "the appropriate use of a community mailing list".  In fact, I
thought about that before I made my post.  In fact, I considered it
multiple times from as many perspectives as I could which provided
useful additional context.

The considerations about posting a carpool communication & "appropriate
use of a mailng list" are really not about mailing lists per se, they
are really about community communication.

The larger, & proper context here, is about doing what is right for the
community as a whole, & lesserly about what might be relevant particular
or germane to the "major" or "main" or "main-specific" purpose of any
one mailing list.

For the community (let me specify it as the GNU(Linux) community) as a
whole, rather than just BALUG, I believe the main consideration guiding
choice of action to take is "is the community as a whole better off for
the action occuring, or less well off".

I believe that 
the more people that attend events like this, 
the more community knowledge is aquired, 
the more plesantness & goodness for people is acquired, 
the more potential for community development & progress is obtained
(like, there is more knowledge in more peoples minds that can lead to
more software development or deployment).

Given the 
 non trivial cost of traveling to such events, & the 
 time involved in traveling, & the 
 time involved in communication to arrange travel, & the 
 small but significant barrier to making the first communication that
 get's the arrangements for carpooling started (posting the first
 "carpool from x to y for event z" message) [in physics this property is
 called "activation energy"], & the 
 increased benefit from posting additional _relevant_ messages once the
 first message text has been created,
I believe it best to post carpool messages 
 to wherever they are likely to do some good,
 in particular, to all the geographical points appropriate for
 carpooling between the endpoints of travel.

In this case, I am traveling from Berkeley to SanMateo, via either
SanFrancisco or Hayward.  Through those paths, the only relevant groups
are the endpoint ones - PenLUG & BUUG (Berkeley Unix Users Group) - &
the in-between ones - which are only the two LUGs in SF, BALUG & SF-LUG.
- so that's where I posted the announcements.

[Side note of evidence for validation of my beliefs:
Before Monday I osted a carpool note about an event at FutureSalon, &
two poeple from sf, from the sflug list, emailed me desiring to ride in
my carpool. - So, GNU(Linux) community members in SanFrancisco did in
fact desire this effort of mine, as recently as of in this past week.]

=====
Thus:
1) "While not totally off topic" - correct, it is, at base, _not_ off
topic.

2) "your message about carpooling to PenLUG would be more appropriate
for the PenLUG mailing list." - correct, "more" & that's why I did post
it _there_, of course.

3) "We" - 
a) since you are some category of recognized "leader" for BALUG
[minor note: I couldn't find your position listed on the website, & dont
recall from memory, thus don't know - are you the leader? president?
speaker coordinator? It might be appropriate & useful to put that on the
website.]
I of course recognize your right to use the group "we" at your
discretion, without needing consultation with the members, when
appropriate.
b) But, in this case, I just note that the "we" [& I know this is a side
point, cause what I'm about to say_isn't_ what the following part of
your sentence will state] isn't unanimous, [re the importnat value of
carpooling notices] since there is at least one BALUG community member
(myself), & probably more, who finds carpool announcements more of a
benefit than detriment to the community

4) "don't want the BALUG list to devolve into a LUG carpool list." - 
a) Specifically, I think almost everyone would agree there is almost
zero likelyhood of that specifically happening - since people are almost
certainly going to continue postings of non carpool matters, it could
never happen that it would "devolve into a LUG carpool list".
b) But generally, to address what I believe is the true idea behind your
statement, & also a likely possibility, that this list could indeed
likely have more carpool notices on it than in the past:
b1) I believe it would be not only a minor number of messages & no more
than a minor (call it whatever pejoritive is appropriate,
"inconvenience"?) inconvenience to list readers,
b2) & that inconvenience is greatly outweighed by the benefits to the
community.

So,
5a) I think relevant carpool messages are more of a benefit than
detriment to the community, & thus should be both unofficially &
officially encouraged.
5b) Thus I call upon you, Andrew, to post an "officially encouraging of
carpool announcements" to this list, to compensate for the (minorly,
IMO) unbeneficial aspects of your post I'm replying to here. [Note: I
just noticed you sent your email to me only, & not to the BALUG list,
thus you didn't cause the detriment I mentioned in the previous sentence
- time is too short for me to rewrite that.]

-----
Pardon any typos & other minor mistakes - I'm very short on time, but
thouht that your authority in the group, & the valid underlying concerns
in you message that are relevant to the GNU(Linux) community deserved a
prompt response, despite my limited time.


Best wishes.