Offer to Film January's BALUG Meeting
Hi BALUG volunteers: Chrisitan Einfeldt is curious to know whether or not he can film BALUG's January meeting. I see no problem with this, but I do know that SVLUG had a bit of an uproar when some of their sessions were recorded by Google and posted on Youtube w/o a free licenses. I would want to ensure that the BALUG community had access to the film. For me, posting to Youtube (or preferably another higher quality site) would be good enough, but having witnessed the SVLUG spat, it might be better to request the film be licensed under the creative commons or something like that. If we don't hear back from anyone on this issue, the default is going to be to let Christian film so long as he makes it accessible to BALUG in some way. -Andrew ---------------------------------------- Andrew Fife Untangle - Open Source Security Gateway download.untangle.com 650.425.3327 (O) 415.806.6028 (C) afife@untangle.com _____ From: Christian Einfeldt [mailto:einfeldt@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2007 7:19 PM To: RSVP@balug.org Subject: RSVPing for January BALUG dinner hi, please put me on the list! Also, would it be okay if I film there? I am not sure that I will, in fact film, simply because the lighting at that restaurant is too dark. But it would be nice to know if I could film there. Maybe just shoot a few people having dinner with Eric and the other BALUGers. Thanks either way. -- Christian Einfeldt, Producer, The Digital Tipping Point
My guess is that Christian is well aware of licensing and permissions legalities. I'd take his assurance that he'll record the event properly, maybe get some notion from him as to how he'll approach the speaker wrt use rights. On Dec 27, 2007, at 10:47 AM, Andrew Fife wrote:
Hi BALUG volunteers: Chrisitan Einfeldt is curious to know whether or not he can film BALUG’s January meeting. I see no problem with this, but I do know that SVLUG had a bit of an uproar when some of their sessions were recorded by Google and posted on Youtube w/o a free licenses. I would want to ensure that the BALUG community had access to the film. For me, posting to Youtube (or preferably another higher quality site) would be good enough, but having witnessed the SVLUG spat, it might be better to request the film be licensed under the creative commons or something like that. If we don’t hear back from anyone on this issue, the default is going to be to let Christian film so long as he makes it accessible to BALUG in some way. -Andrew
---------------------------------------- Andrew Fife Untangle - Open Source Security Gateway download.untangle.com
650.425.3327 (O) 415.806.6028 (C) afife@untangle.com
From: Christian Einfeldt [mailto:einfeldt@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2007 7:19 PM To: RSVP@balug.org Subject: RSVPing for January BALUG dinner hi,
please put me on the list!
Also, would it be okay if I film there? I am not sure that I will, in fact film, simply because the lighting at that restaurant is too dark. But it would be nice to know if I could film there. Maybe just shoot a few people having dinner with Eric and the other BALUGers.
Thanks either way.
-- Christian Einfeldt, Producer, The Digital Tipping Point _______________________________________________ Balug-Admin mailing list Balug-Admin@lists.balug.org http://lists.balug.org/listinfo.cgi/balug-admin-balug.org
Quoting jim stockford (jim@well.com):
My guess is that Christian is well aware of licensing and permissions legalities.
With one possible exception. Concerning Google, Inc.'s footage of the SVLUG event, Christian said: The Digital Tipping Point uses by-SA. I would not recommend a by-NC-SA license or any other configuration using the NC restriction, because it means that no one can ever put up any footage on any site that *might* generate revenue in any way, shape or form, not even Google ads, which are rather ubiquitous. 1. This is not what CC BY-NC-SA 3.0 (current version) says, at all. Its restriction against commercial use is narrowly scoped to the actual file access, and is covered in section 4(c): You may not exercise any of the rights granted to You in Section 3 above in any manner that is primarily intended for or directed toward commercial advantage or private monetary compensation. The exchange of the Work for other copyrighted works by means of digital file-sharing or otherwise shall not be considered to be intended for or directed toward commercial advantage or private monetary compensation, provided there is no payment of any monetary compensation in connection with the exchange of copyrighted works. So, Christian either didn't bother to read the licence he was commenting on, or didn't read it correctly. 2. Even rights specifically denied by an attached licence can be granted as required for individual recipients. E.g., I make some of my works available under GPLv2, but am willing to grant other rights to people who can explain to me why they need them. 3. Also, as a special case (to remind people), the _licensor_ is never bound by the licence terms. So, Google, Inc. as copyright owner of the SVLUG Flash video can do pretty much whatever it chooses with that work, including putting ads next to it.
I'd take his assurance that he'll record the event properly, maybe get some notion from him as to how he'll approach the speaker wrt use rights.
In particular, I'm sure he'll use something less open-source hostile than Macromedia Flash. ;->
hi On Dec 27, 2007 10:47 AM, Andrew Fife <afife@untangle.com> wrote:
Hi BALUG volunteers:
Chrisitan Einfeldt is curious to know whether or not he can film BALUG's January meeting. I see no problem with this, but I do know that SVLUG had a bit of an uproar when some of their sessions were recorded by Google and posted on Youtube w/o a free licenses.
Everything that the DTP cameras shoot will be released under a cc by-SA license and posted to the Internet Archive's Digital Tipping Point Video Collection (IA DTP VC). We already have 56 hours of such video in raw form posted here: http://www.archive.org/details.php?identifier=digitaltippingpoint That footage is raw footage, and will need to be re-rendered before it is used in any final project. Our keyword search index page is located below. It is the place to go to find specific persons or themes for our footage. The Internet Archive is currently changing its search software, and so the index might not be operational again until January 3, 2008, although we have had occasion full service restored intermittently. The index is operational today. Here is the index page nonetheless: http://tinyurl.com/yluwoc I would want to ensure that the BALUG community had access to the film. For
me, posting to Youtube (or preferably another higher quality site) would be good enough, but having witnessed the SVLUG spat, it might be better to request the film be licensed under the creative commons or something like that.
I am a big fan of YouTube, but we nonetheless release all of our footage on the IA DTP VC under a cc by-SA license simulatenously with any YouTube release, for a couple of reasons: 1) the IA has a great index; 2) less concerns with licensing, as our cc by-SA license is plainly evident; 3) the IA DTP VC footage exists in both ogg theora and .mpg format, which means that it will be indexable and taggable by Annodex technology when that becomes widely available; 4) both of those formats are offered in relatively hi-res format, which makes it more useful for people who want to rip and mix it for Internet video; 5) it gives the community some sense of ownership of the video.
If we don't hear back from anyone on this issue, the default is going to be to let Christian film so long as he makes it accessible to BALUG in some way.
Please note that it might take a little while for the footage to be posted to the IA DTP VC, as we need to rough edit it first, and we have a long line of footage ahead of it. But if we could get some help from the community in rough editing the footage for our film, we would really appreciate it. Please do recall that this is *your* footage, meaning that it will all be available for free (as in freedom) and free (as in beer). We are hoping that the community will take ownership of it, which means chipping in to help get the word out there to the world. We are doing all of our editing on FOSS tools, and so we hope that this DTP film will be the world's first film about FOSS using all FOSS tools and finished in a collaborative FOSS fashion. One of our community members has even written a nice BASH tool chain to take some of the drudgery out of doing the work: http://digitaltippingpoint.com/wiki/index.php?title=From_Tape_to_Archive The other thing to remember is that audio in that room will be really tough. The best solution to solving the problem is to use a wireless lav mic that we can hand around. Lighting will also be tough, and so if people want to bring lights, that would be great. Painters' lights work really well, although since that room is so huge, we will need several people to bring such lights. The DTP project truly is an open source project in every sense of the phrase. The story is our story; it literally is going to be a movie about us -- the people in our community. Of course, we have also traveled to 6 nations and 3 continents getting footage on historical figures such as the Mayor of Munich and the Culture MInister of Brazil and an IT adviser to now UK Prime Minister Gordon Brown. A rough proof of concept video is here to demonstrate that we have interviewed all of the above, as well as Jack Messman, the former CEO of Novell: http://www.archive.org/details/proof_of_concept_four_mins.mpg The goal of our film is to link up all these far-flung individuals to show how we are working together across language, geographic barriers, and language barriers to bring freedom to cyberspace around the world. Our local community will act as an example of the broader global movement. Thanks either way for considering our request, folks! -- Christian Einfeldt, Producer, The Digital Tipping Point
I've got no problem/issue(s) with it being filmed - or I presume video taped or the like. Should confirm it's okay with our speaker - Andrew - do you want to ensure we cover that? Licensing? Whomever records it can likely release it under whatever license(s) they want ... the more generally free in terms of freedom, (and also cost) the less likely to generally trigger grumblings and such. Quoting Andrew Fife <afife@untangle.com>:
Chrisitan Einfeldt is curious to know whether or not he can film BALUG's January meeting. I see no problem with this, but I do know that SVLUG had a bit of an uproar when some of their sessions were recorded by Google and posted on Youtube w/o a free licenses.
I would want to ensure that the BALUG community had access to the film. For me, posting to Youtube (or preferably another higher quality site) would be good enough, but having witnessed the SVLUG spat, it might be better to request the film be licensed under the creative commons or something like that.
If we don't hear back from anyone on this issue, the default is going to be to let Christian film so long as he makes it accessible to BALUG in some way.
From: Christian Einfeldt [mailto:einfeldt@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2007 7:19 PM To: RSVP@balug.org Subject: RSVPing for January BALUG dinner
Also, would it be okay if I film there? I am not sure that I will, in fact film, simply because the lighting at that restaurant is too dark. But it would be nice to know if I could film there. Maybe just shoot a few people having dinner with Eric and the other BALUGers.
Thanks either way.
Michael brings up a good point. I know that ESR values his privacy and we need to get his okay prior to filming. I will reach out to him via email. Christian: in the event that I do not hear back from ESR regarding this issue, which is a possibility, I suggest that you bring your equipment and we simple ask his permission the night of the event. Unless you think that is too forward. ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Paoli <Michael.Paoli@cal.berkeley.edu> To: Andrew Fife <afife@untangle.com>, 'Christian Einfeldt' <einfeldt@gmail.com> Cc: balug-admin@lists.balug.org Sent: Thu, 27 Dec 2007 17:37:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: Re: Offer to Film January's BALUG Meeting I've got no problem/issue(s) with it being filmed - or I presume video taped or the like. Should confirm it's okay with our speaker - Andrew - do you want to ensure we cover that? Licensing? Whomever records it can likely release it under whatever license(s) they want ... the more generally free in terms of freedom, (and also cost) the less likely to generally trigger grumblings and such. Quoting Andrew Fife <afife@untangle.com>:
Chrisitan Einfeldt is curious to know whether or not he can film BALUG's January meeting. I see no problem with this, but I do know that SVLUG had a bit of an uproar when some of their sessions were recorded by Google and posted on Youtube w/o a free licenses.
I would want to ensure that the BALUG community had access to the film. For me, posting to Youtube (or preferably another higher quality site) would be good enough, but having witnessed the SVLUG spat, it might be better to request the film be licensed under the creative commons or something like that.
If we don't hear back from anyone on this issue, the default is going to be to let Christian film so long as he makes it accessible to BALUG in some way.
From: Christian Einfeldt [mailto:einfeldt@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2007 7:19 PM To: RSVP@balug.org Subject: RSVPing for January BALUG dinner
Also, would it be okay if I film there? I am not sure that I will, in fact film, simply because the lighting at that restaurant is too dark. But it would be nice to know if I could film there. Maybe just shoot a few people having dinner with Eric and the other BALUGers.
Thanks either way.
hi On Dec 27, 2007 9:28 PM, Andrew Fife <afife@untangle.com> wrote:
Michael brings up a good point. I know that ESR values his privacy and we need to get his okay prior to filming. I will reach out to him via email.
Christian:
in the event that I do not hear back from ESR regarding this issue, which is a possibility, I suggest that you bring your equipment and we simple ask his permission the night of the event. Unless you think that is too forward.
I am totally okay with this proposal ! We might need help with lighting, though. If we could please put out a call to have people bring some painters lights, that would be great!
participants (5)
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Andrew Fife
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Christian Einfeldt
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jim stockford
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Michael Paoli
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Rick Moen